Comments for Doctrinally Justifiable Treason at http://www.ldsfreemen.com , comment 1 to 5 out of 5 comments http://www.ldsfreemen.com Fri, 21 Nov 2008 00:35:52 +0100 FeedCreator 1.7.2 http://www.ldsfreemen.com/connor-boyack/doctrinally-justifiable-treason.html#comment-70 Like everybody else before me, great article. Daniel, Shadrack, Meshack, & Abendigo - among others from the scriptures - are all considered heros for rebelling against the rule of men when it conflicted with their religious convictions. We are all morally bound to follow natural law (i.e. the laws of God) - or that law which is based upon the rights of men. Laws of men, or legislation, is not natural law. - Jeremy Ashton Mon, 14 Apr 2008 18:37:34 +0100 http://www.ldsfreemen.com/connor-boyack/doctrinally-justifiable-treason.html#comment-69 Connor, Great article. Generally I agree with the intent and tenor of the 12th article of faith. And sometimes it is better to suffer at the hands of unrighteous laws than to willy nilly take the law into your own hands. On the other hand, you might be interested in a compilation of quotes I put on the web in 2002 (great quotes, but it's in sad need of a facelift due to various formatting errors and problems) regarding our duty and responsibility when a law of God conflicts with a law of man. [url]http://www.geocities.com/graymada/laws.html[/url] - Steven Montgomery Mon, 14 Apr 2008 16:09:14 +0100 http://www.ldsfreemen.com/connor-boyack/doctrinally-justifiable-treason.html#comment-58 Great article. - Mormon Paleo Fri, 11 Apr 2008 19:25:06 +0100 http://www.ldsfreemen.com/connor-boyack/doctrinally-justifiable-treason.html#comment-53 Jeremey - I agree. I don't expect the Church to come out in such bold opposition, as they may once have. I discuss this more in my "Prophetic Political Silence" article. But as you note, I believe there is a distinction between the Church itself and your average member. I believe that we as individuals must take it upon ourselves to be the movers and shakers. I'm reading more right now about the story of Helmuth Hübener, a 17 year old LDS resistance fighter, actively working to thwart the Nazi campaign. His story is fascinating, and relates to the discussion here, especially given the fact that he faced opposition from his local church leader regarding his resistance. Anywho, I agree - I think it's an individual matter instead of an organizational Church one. - Connor Fri, 11 Apr 2008 15:56:38 +0100 http://www.ldsfreemen.com/connor-boyack/doctrinally-justifiable-treason.html#comment-52 President Monson in the priesthood session: [quote]"As bearers of the priesthood, we have been placed on earth in troubled times. We live in a complex world with currents of conflict everywhere to be found. Political machinations ruin the stability of nations, [b]despots[/b] grasp for power, and segments of society seem forever downtrodden, deprived of opportunity, and left with a feeling of failure."[/quote] Contrast that with this from the Declaration of Independence: [quote]"But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object [b]evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism[/b], it is their right, [b]it is their [u]duty[/u][/b], [b]to throw off such Government[/b], and to provide new Guards for their future security."[/quote] I believe that as in Germany under Hitler, the church fulfilled the greater good (ordinances and covenants of the gospel) by upholding the 12th article of faith. Had they not, the church would have been shut down and the greater good stifled for many years. That does not however mean that we are not justified (perhaps even sanctified) in opposing such a thing as was the Nazi state at that time. On the contrary, the God given Declaration of Independence informs us that it is then our duty. Just don't look for a church endorsement or even tolerance for your actions. The laws of God to the church and to us in this matter are clearly different. The only question is whether our government has as it's aim, despotism? - Jeremy Parker Fri, 11 Apr 2008 15:15:28 +0100